English Speaking Jobs in Germany?!?

metalfan2405
CanuckAbroad Regular


Canuck

Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 35
Location: Wiesbaden, Germany (From: London, Ontario, Canada)

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2007 10:04 am

 

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Scott is right, the German education system is total crap and racism is common in Germany. The only way kids can get a good education in Germany is if they go to a Gymnasium or private school. The "Realschule" and "Hauptschule" are just day cares.
Its true, in some cases, you won't be accepted as an equal, you'll always be an "Ausländer" (foreigner), thats how Germany is divided in to, "the germans" and "the foreigners". I think it's because integration is very poor here and the germans are old fashioned, they don't know what globalization is, some still think that Canadians only belong in Canada and Germans in Germany and the French in France, you'll always be a guest in Germany.
I found that if you speak english to the Germans, you will be more respected than if you speak German to them. You're "spirier" then.
As for english jobs, they can be hard to come by. The best and fastest way is to get a job at an embassy or consulate of an english speaking country or the armed forces.
I don't want to scare you off, or make Germany look bad, but I have to tell you, it's different.

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wyatt
Junior Member



Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Posts: 20
Location: Düsseldorf

Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:37 am

 

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First of all I stand by statement that the German education system is "horrible", however I did not mention anything of the kind about Racism (because I have never personal experienced anything like that). FYI I have lived here for over 10 years and I went to school here too completing a German Ausbildung in computer programming at the age of 37. I also have 3 children in the system. If it were not for my (German) wife helping the kids with their homework and ensuring they understood the days lessons then at least one or more would end up in a Sonder school instead they are all bound for Gymnasium, So once again I will repeat what I said "I have to agree with Scott the German education system is horrible at best but its not hopeless"

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dannykool
CanuckAbroad Regular


You can't win if you don't play

Joined: 16 Oct 2007
Posts: 46
Location: Switzerland

Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 8:41 am

 

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I think if you go to any NON-english speaking country, you will find the same issues i.e you are a foreigner and there are few jobs with English as the only requirement. I am sure this is the same in Montreal. So that is clear: one has to invest in the language for a few years and then maybe.

Racism is alive in several countries, not just Germany. Europe has always been xenophobic. No not just Germany. You just have to fight.

As for the education system it is 2:1 here on the forum in favor of it being horrible. Would need more volume to justify that.

So much for globalization.

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SIGINT
New Member



Joined: 09 Dec 2007
Posts: 6
Location: HAMBURG

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 2:06 am

 

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Alright, there is nothing wrong with a good debate. So, in order to support my arguments, I can only speak for myself. I have finished my Abitur with ease and I don't find the education system hard at all. Sure there are Realschule and Hauptschule, but they kinda need them. With a country of 88 million people and a ration of 3:2 for foreigners, I think it is necessary that Germany has a filtering system in place. With regards to "wyatt" okay you have 3 children, so I assume they hold dual citizenship. If not, then they would be attending school illegally. Maybe your children are not doing as much work for school as they should do. For example, in grade 8 I went back home to Canada as part of an exchange program. Funny doing an exchange program into your own country but anyway. I went straight to grade 11 since the grade 8 9 and 10 were to easy for me and teachers felt the need that I need to work with people with the same or similar kind of knowledge. Hence, that would mean that the German Education System puts way more effort into their education system in order to effectively support those who are smart and those who are average.

The Germans have a lot of good things on the market and it is surely not because their education system sucks.
Another example, our own Government buys tons of equipment from the German Armed Forces in order to support us in the Canadian Forces. Why, well quality, design and flawlessness to name a few. Is all that equipment based on good education? Well kinda yes.

As for the racism aspect, well folks I hate to disappoint you, but I encountered more acts of racism within the Canadian Forces than I've ever in Germany. Wow, right in the kisser. And the crap (sorry my language) with Germans for Germans, French for French, Irish for Irish and so on, that's just bullshit. If there is one country that is more for globalization than the U.S. it sure is Germany.
I'm not trying to sweet talk Germany since Canada is always my number one, but I hate if someone criticize something with no facts.
Okay, personal experience is okay and understandable, but what about the facts. The majority of Canadians can't even afford to go to university unless they get a student loan in Canada. And which graduated student wants to start his career with a bank account of -50.000,00$. I've done my bachelor of science in Germany and the total coast for the whole thing including books was 3.000,00 bucks. And when I moved back home to Canada, the German B.S. was higher recognized than others. Is this really based on a education system that is so horrible such as the German?
I'd rather have a challenging school system in place then a school system were maybe even your kids sit next to hillbillies and basically learn almost nothing.

So, please prove me wrong.
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wyatt
Junior Member



Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Posts: 20
Location: Düsseldorf

Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 7:20 am

 

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Pisa

page 16 is intresting.

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SIGINT
New Member



Joined: 09 Dec 2007
Posts: 6
Location: HAMBURG

Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 2:38 am

 

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Do you have one that is not 7 years old? And BTW, I did the Pisa in Canada that year and my friend saved a copy from the one tested in Germany. Pisa is based on the Lehrplan from every country or in Canada it is the provincial school board. So, I agree with you that the Pisa study shows Germany way below Canada, but on the other hand I have to say that the Pisa study was conducted in all four school systems. That would mean that Gymnasium, Gesamtschule, Realschule and Hauptschule. Plus of course the Grundschule. So okay the Pisa study is one way to attack this matter. But here is the interesting thing about it. Lets just say that the while I was back home, they asked me questions like how many states does the U.S. have, how many provinces and territories does Canada blah blah blah. Okay, that is kinda easy would you not agree? My friend on the other hand sad that in the German Pisa Case study they asked questions like how many dynasties were present in China from that and that century, which one was the biggest, why did Chinese people always carry a red book with them. When was the student revolution. So as you can see the spectrum of questions where way different and harder for the German people. And of course for the people in the Gesamt-, Haupt- and Realschule things were different. First is the ration of German speaking kids and not German speaking kids 1:2 which would clearly identify why in the Pisa study Germans got hardly any points for performing in their supposedly own language. But there are more case studies done by the Goethe Institute, the University of Madrid and Cambridge University that show that the Pisa study is not conducted well enough, since it does not allow the factor of the amount of cultural presence in classrooms and other things. Pisa should make a test that is equal and every country should do the same test.

So, thanks for trying to assault the German education system with a 7 year old case study but, things have changed. And things changed way before 2005.

And back to you!
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metalfan2405
CanuckAbroad Regular


Canuck

Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 35
Location: Wiesbaden, Germany (From: London, Ontario, Canada)

Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 9:17 am

 

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I have no idea where you went to school in Germany, but where I go it’s not like that, some of the kids I go to school with (Gesamtschule grade 11) couldn't even find their own Bundesland and city on a map, let alone China or how many dynasties were present in China from certain centuries. I know an English student teacher from the UK who is visiting us at our school and she told me that some of the grade 8 students she works with can't even spell the names of the months. They spell April with an E (Apriel) and März with T (Märtz). Besides horrible literacy and geography, there is no discipline (even though the Germans are known for discipline - yeah right). For example, you can see some little 6th grader bad mouthing his teacher, playing around with a lighter trying to light a classmate on fire, vandalizing school and city property, smoking, etc, etc. I would NEVER, EVER see that back home in Canada (ok, maybe the vandalism, but not at the same degree). They definitely need an education reform here in Germany.
As for what you said about the Canadian Forces and racism, SIGINT, I have friends that are with the forces (air force and army) and they never mentioned anything negative about the forces or the way they are treated or anybody else, but I will ask them specifically about racism. In Germany on the other hand, I never (or maybe just rarely) heard anybody say "African-American"(or African-European in this case) to a black person; they just went right ahead and used the "N Word". I had to explain to them what that really means, and what would happen to them if they used it in Canada or the US.
As for your university argument, I barely even met anybody here that wants to go to university (everybody wants to do the "Ausbildung" which is just a waste of your youth in my opinion). All my friends back home plan on going, not to mention myself and that without a loan.
As for globalization in Germany, I can't seem to find a hint of it here. I have a cousin who works in Dusseldorf. Even though the business language is English at her company and the company is American, her colleagues are giving her a hard time because she doesn’t speak German. They just want her to speak German because it would make everything a whole lot easier for them and they wouldn’t have to improve their English.

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wyatt
Junior Member



Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Posts: 20
Location: Düsseldorf

Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 6:31 am

 

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Psia 2006

Judging from my experiences all I can add is that the material that the kids need to learn is provided, however the kids are not being taught, it is up to the kids themselves with the help of the parents to learn the material. There is a high proportion of immigrants in Germany who don’t speak the language well enough to be able to help their kids, combine that with native families where both parents are working and have no time or just don’t care and its receipt for disaster.

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