Help! I was refused entry for "attempted to work illega

On Nov. 27, 2007, I entered an agreement with a new automotive show and sales company in Dearborn, MI, as their off-site sales representative in Canada. The company asked me to attend their weekly inf...

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Canadian Expatriate and Travellers Forum Index -> Canadians in the USA -> US Visas and Immigration

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Steven
CanuckAbroad VIP

Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1589
Location: Calgary

Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 7:46 am

Reba wrote: except all Canadian international airports have US customs pre-clearing, so you're not flying back, you're just driving home in most cases. Unless you've flown in from some smaller airport with a connection at an international.

Even then there is a bigger cost involved because you've wasted a ticket, and I'm sure they realize that's going to mean a greater chance of a formal complaint or a nasty letter to the editor, etc. I have to admit most of my flights into the US are via Europe, and sending someone back to Europe on a refusal is going to be a big deal for them. They're talking about doing pre-clearance at Heathrow but I think they gave up on the idea because they couldn't find enough US citizens to staff it properly.

The other thing I've noticed at airports with pre-clearance is that you have a greater chance of dealing with someone who is actually a Canadian who happens to have US citizenship, or at least an American who has lived in Canada for awhile. I'm not sure if people who work at Vancouver airport commute back to Washington but they don't at Calgary - they live in Calgary. So they tend to be much less suspicious of Canadians than at the land borders, where they tend to live in trailer parks in the middle of nowhere.

At least I can say that Calgary airport is a much nicer place to go through immigration than Sweetgrass, MT is, by an order of magnitude. However I have found if I go through some of the really small border crossings they tend to be much friendlier and helpful. But frankly I've been through immigration at Calgary and on one occasion the total sum of the conversation was:

"You going on vacation?"

"Yeah."

That was it.
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Steve.

Steven
CanuckAbroad VIP

Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 1589
Location: Calgary

Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 8:00 am

flames9 wrote: And if u stated to the POE that ur entering as a vistito and they prove otherwise, that could lead to a lot of problems. Slim sure, but ya never know.

If you enter for a business meeting or a vacation, either way it's a visit and it's the same entry procedure. You can't specifically say: "Oh, I want to be in the B-2 category", they approve it for B-1/2 which means dual use. Legally, I read that as being in a situation where you could enter on vacation and out of the blue someone could ask for a meeting with you over some business proposition and that would be entirely lawful. So I'm not clear on just how much you actually have to tell USCIS, all you have to do is provide them enough information for them to determine the entry requirements.

Maybe someone can enlighten me on the likelihood of it being considered illegal, but how often does anyone go to the US on a business trip and not go shopping and do vacation-like things at the same time? No doubt this was the reason for combining the categories in the first place.

Bear in mind that USCIS at the end of the day are not the final word on this, the courts are. Are they going to drag you into federal court over this? Are they going to be able to initiate deportation proceedings when you've already left the country after a meeting anyway? Because once you're there the only way of doing anything to you is to do something like that and personally I think the chances of it are beyond slim.

What is a "business meeting" anyway for the purposes of Title 8? Is it even defined in the Code of Federal Regulations? Is there case law on it?

It's such a tenuous thing anyway, I've had business meetings where business is barely mentioned and you just sit there getting drunk for 2 hours.

I'm willing to bet serious money that no Canadian has ever been deported or prosecuted for having a business meeting after saying they entered to go on vacation. Nearly all Canadians that are deported from the US appear to get deported for committing criminal offences that come to the attention of the police.
_________________
Steve.

flames9
Senior Member

Joined: 08 Mar 2007
Posts: 113
Location: Falls Church VA

Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2007 8:19 am

When I was going through my Cr-1 visa process and traveled monthly to DC, I kept my responses short and sweet. Never lied, but short and sweet!
Coming back from Saskatoon this summer, the fellow next to turned out to be from my home town (didnt know him)but we chatted away. He owned a farm machinery store and the year before he and a few of his employees were barred entry into the USA to attend a trade show. They weren't selling anything, but were going down to just look at the newest farm machinery coming out in the next few years!