Living in Canada and working for USA company remotely

Bear in mind it's very important that you do it, because it is your client who will get into trouble if you don't. They must have a Form 8233 on file for foreign contractors they use, to prove to the IRS they don't have to do NRA withholding. If they don't have one on file, the IRS can assess penalties against them.

Your paperwork (tax return and 8833) is so that they can match them up, so if they audit your client, the money going out to you (on their ledgers) matches what is being declared on the return, so it enables them to audit your client effectively.

Also it's done to stop "tax treaty" shopping, e.g. if you were based in a country with a higher NRA rate than Canada they can see from year to year which treaty provision you're claiming on your 8233 and 8833.

The thing that always gets up my nose about it is that it doesn't appear to be at first glance to be that much paperwork, especially if you're self-employed as the 1040NR is only three pages long and it's quite easy to fill in. So you get to the end of that and look at the fiddly forms 8833 and 8233, but they are completely open-ended and you haven't got the faintest clue what to put on them unless you're an expert on the tax treaty.

So at this point you call up the IRS and spend all day on the phone waiting for an agent who knows the answer to the question.

IRS publication 597 helps a little bit, but it's out-of-date as the tax treaty has changed.

It made sense to me that I would have to file some type of return in the States in order for it to balance things out with my client. I will make sure they have the required form on file and also take care of the tax forms I need to file. I'm wondering if it might be worth hiring an international tax guy or gal to file these forms for me as bashing my head against the keyboard for an entire day as I try to figure these things out doesn't seem too appealing.

Thanks again!

Ken

The "get an accountant" to do it answer is overrated, rarely in these sorts of situations do they know how to do it. I'm sure there's an accountant somewhere who does, but by the time you find him, you will probably be on your third or fourth accountant after the first few made a hash job of it and you're seriously out-of-pocket.

I've spoken to lots of so-called expert accountants, they will usually be better than a regular accountant, but they aren't the IRS.

My advice is to try and DIY and if you get really stuck, phone the IRS, and if you're still stuck, then get in touch with an accountant, who you will be able to ask specific questions of because you'll have a better understanding of how to do it by then.

What I put above I'm pretty sure is largely the answer, but I wouldn't take my word for it, double-check with the IRS to make sure. A few hours waiting on hold is cheaper (and probably quicker) than finding an accountant who will know little more than me.

I know that this is an old string, but I'm trying to dig up further information about filing taxes if I am a Canadian working for a US company in Canada. I have a TN, and travel to different US locations for work on occasion, however I am in Canada most of the time.
I know that there is a 1040NR form involved, but I am a complete novice with tax rules and forms. I understand in principle that my US company will withold taxes, and that I will be responsible for filing a return in Canada and paying taxes here. As I understand it, I somehow get the Canadian government to "count" the taxes witheld from me in the US, and I pay the balance of what I would have owed to the Canadian gov't based on my Canadian income tax rate. Is that right? So my follow up question: How do I get that ball in motion? Does my company have to do anything special? What do I have to submit and to whom when doing my taxes in each country?

(I really am hopeless with this stuff, so don't hesitate to answer as though you were talking to a 5th grader...)

There are about a million threads on here about it if you look, also have a read of IRS publication 519, the general guide for the T1 and also this: http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/E/pub/tg/p151/README.html

Hi Steve and all the experts,

I am a Canadian, working for a US company in Asia as a contractor. I don't need to go USA for work, but I visited USA a few times a year for pleasure in the past. Recently I was denied at the border, they said since I get paid by USA company, no matter where I am, I should get Work Visa.

My questions:
1. Does the reason of denial entry make sense? I told them a few times I don't work in USA, and my passport shows my travel in Asia.
2. Did they talk to my USA company, they didn't ask for the telephone number.
3. They denied my entry (this is the first time), will this affect my future entry?
4. What should I do to be allowed to enter USA? Get Work permit? But I don't work in USA.
5. A friend of mine was denied entry as well, because he forgot to return the I-94 within 6 months, he was one month late, the reason being that they have no proof that he left USA. Does this usually happen? Can he go to the border and try again in a few months?
6. I was thinking all this happened because I didn't smile enough at the border. They don't sound nice.

Thanks!

David

-- Tue May 05, 2009 12:32 pm --

Forgot to add, the BP said that the deny of entry applies to all borders, it would be stupid to try to get in from another border.

What does this mean?

No it doesn't make sense, but these things rarely do. Even if you were entering for work-related reasons, the denial doesn't make sense because it's entirely legitimate to enter the US to have a meeting with your employer. The only question really is are you a direct employee of that company or do you just invoice them? In the latter scenario it definitely doesn't make sense and otherwise they would only have a case if you're issued a W-2, which the employer shouldn't do because you work abroad.

If you've been denied then yes, you will have problems in the future but it's not a ban so you can legitimately try again and hope to get a CBP officer who is not such a tool.

The final comment is merely that the denial of entry can be seen at any POE, however given that the denial was flaky imo then trying at another POE so you get a different agent probably is the best way to do it.

Your friend is going to have tougher sledding, because it appears they think he overstayed.

Hi, Steve,

Thank you very much for the response. I have been on line waiting．　

About my employment: I was hired as a contractor, paid by salary. I told the officer that I worked in USA from 2001-2006, and back to Canada when I got married in 06. I plan to go to USA merely for sightseeing and shopping, a hotel was booked. When the officer told me that I was denied entry to USA outside of the building, she said I worked for US company, and I said I didn't work in USA. She said I took an opportunity from US citizen. She gave me a paper for Canadian border officer. She said I should not try any other POE, and it would be stupid to try.

-- Tue May 05, 2009 3:15 pm --

Steve,

I was never denied to enter USA, I tried to USA since 1998, numerous times, for work and pleasure. And I lived in USA for 5 years. The officer asked if I have house in USA, I told her no.

Should I write a letter to explain what has happened, to
Customs and Border Protection
Customer Service Center, Rosslyn Virginia
1300 Pennsylvania Ave. N.W.
Washington, DC 20229.

I have more questions：
1. I would like to try other POE, will I be banned?
2. They took my fingerprints and photo, what kind of record left?
3. Should I write a letter according to the above website?
4. Any suggestion that the USA company can do for me, to resolve the problem? They will need be to go there for meetings once or twice a year.

Thanks a lot again!

-David

-- Tue May 05, 2009 3:20 pm --

Steve,

For my friend, his I-94 was issued on Oct 3, 2008, expired on April 3. He visited USA in Oct and Dec. He studies and works in Canada, and gave the phone number to the officer (the officer asked for it). But still, the officer said he has no proof that my friend left USA. My friend is a permenant resident of Canada.

Can my friend try again with some "proof"? My friend said when he left, he asked the officer if he can come back tomorrow and be allowed to enter USA, the officer said not sure.

David

Thanks!

David

-- Tue May 05, 2009 3:40 pm --

Hi, Steve,

For a Canadian working for a USA company in other country, is it required for him to get a work VISA on non-business trip?

I know people working for USA companies in other countries, they have no problem visiting USA for meetings, and pleasure.

Can I find the inforamtion somewhere, so next time I go to POE, I can show it to them?

Thanks!

David

-- Tue May 05, 2009 4:11 pm --

Steve,

Am I denied entry under the visa waiver programme? i.e. do I have to apply Visa before entering USA in the future?

Thanks!

David

Teh CBP should not have denied you entry on the basis that you work for a US based company, but not in the US. You're not there taking an American's job, if you're working in Asia. You just happened to catch someone on a cranky day unfortunately. No, you are not required to get a work visa to work for a US company outside of US soil. Nor would/should you need a work visa just to go to the US to visit. I worked for a US company for 13 years, but at the Canadian offices, didn't need a US visa until I was actually going to the US office to work.

If you're not working, you don't need a work visa. Plain and simple. I suspect you had something work related on your person, or in your luggage that made them suspect you would be working. Next time, don't bring any work related stuff with you. Not even a laptop if you can help it.

I don't think writing a letter will help really. Just try again some other time and hope you get someone in a better mood. They'll be able to see the record of your denial on their computer when they scan your passport, and may send you to secondary, just be prepared to show them proof that you are there specifically for a vacation, and you will not be doing any sort of work while there. Have proof that you are on approved leave from your job in Asia, and you're just shopping or whatever. No guarantees of course, but there's not much else you can do.

As for your friend, he should mail back the I-94, with a letter of explanation as to why he did not turn it in when he left the country as he should have. Really, it is up to the border patrol to make sure they take it, but they don't always, so a lot of people are caught having to mail it. If he has proof of when he left the US, like a ticket receipt, or stamp in his passport from when he re-entered Canada, send a photocopy of that with the I-94 to the appropriate USCIS address (I believe it is on the back of the I-94 itself).

If he drove back and has no hard proof, unfortunately there's not much he can do other than give it a year or so and try again some other time to go visit.

Hi, Reba,

Thanks a lot! Your and Steve's responses really made feel that I may be OK. It caught me off gaurd when the officer said I was denied entry because I am taking US citizen job. I told them clearly I don't work in USA, and I am going to USA for pleasure. They know for sure that I don't work in USA for this trip, because my passport is full of Customs stamps from different Asian countries. I had a few cloth and laptop in my car, nothing else. Can I go to USA for meetings in the future? Will the USA company be helpful for meeting purpose?

My friend turned in I-94 when he tried to enter USA. He drove back to Canada, but he can get proof from work or school, will that be helpful? He can also get all the other proof, bank statements, phone bills, etc. Also, he will apply for his citizenship next year, is it better to enter USA after he gets his citizenship?

David