Web Designer in USA - need a visa to telecommute?

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wartNew Member
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Location: Toronto

Web Designer in USA - need a visa to telecommute?

Post Mon Jun 23, 2008 5:32 pm

I am a Canadian citizen who does contract web design work for various Canadian small businesses, I have no long term employer. I am planning to go travel through the states and work on websites from my laptop while I am there. I won't be staying any longer than 6 months maximum and intend on coming back to Canada. I just want to work while I'm traveling to earn money.

My product i am producing is 100% virtual (web sites). Even my invoices are just emailed files. While I'm traveling everyone is paying me online by depositing directly into my Canadian Bank account.

Can anyone shed light on what is required of me visa wise? what do i say when i cross the boarder? I was planning on leaving on my trip in a couple of weeks. Am I in trouble?

Thanks so much for any advice/info anyone can offer.
Last edited by wart on Mon Jun 23, 2008 9:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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StevenCanuckAbroad VIP
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Location: Calgary

Post Mon Jun 23, 2008 8:55 pm

It's not legal to work in the US this way. But there's pretty much no way to legally do it as the law hasn't caught up with technology yet. And there's essentially no way to catch you unless you do it under the nose of a USCIS officer.

I wouldn't worry about it too much, especially if your customers are Canadians. Look at it this way, if you get busted for it, it will make interesting case law. The one I want an answer to is if you are doing work on your laptop in a transit lounge in the US. Technically you're not in the US - but you are.

Writers have been having this problem forever, basically. You're working, because you're writing - but who knows where you did the writing? And there's no visa for it specifically unless you're a journalist.

If you're going into the US to search for clients, then you're going to have a problem. Just going into the US to canvas for work will get you denied entry. If you have specific meetings set up with specific clients then those are business meetings and it's a B-1 entry. But have proof of it, business cards, dates and times of meetings you're going to, etc.

You can go in and "negotiate contracts or take orders" but this assumes some sort of pre-existing relationship.

These are the permitted activities in B-1 status for Canadians: http://www.americanlaw.com/1603a1.html
Steve.
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wartNew Member
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Posts: 5
Joined: 23 Jun 2008
Location: Toronto

Post Mon Jun 23, 2008 9:06 pm

Hey Steve, thanks for your reply. No, all of my customers are Canadians and I am not looking for any US clients while i'm there. I simply wish to continue working for my Canadian clients while there to give me money to keep traveling within the allowed six months out of the year.

So what do I do? I don't want to get caught and kicked out, I'm hoping to get to do this kind of travel frequently to both the US and UK, since my office is literally just wherever my laptop is. How do I do this legitimately?

So confused.
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StevenCanuckAbroad VIP
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Post Mon Jun 23, 2008 9:48 pm

It is tricky, moreso from a tax standpoint actually. Canada and the UK aren't quite as anal as the US about it, if you work in Canada and the UK "incidentally" which I've been told means less than two weeks a year (i.e. a typical vacation) then there are no tax implications and immigration don't care. This is from case law. Otherwise if your boss phoned you up while you were on vacation to ask you a question you would be breaking the law.

The US basically has no provision for it from an immigration standpoint, so it boils down to whether you get caught. It is illegal but given the lack of case law I suspect no-one has been caught (yet). I suspect (but this is merely an opinion) that a US court would probably rule in a similar way to the Canadian and UK courts. At the end of the day your work has no impact on their economy and you are simply spending money like you would on vacation, so one would hope a court would see it that way.

You might want to have a read of this: http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/E/pub/tg/p151/README.html

To do it "legitimately" I suspect would require E-1 or E-2 visa in the US which is way OTT for what you're talking about or worse yet, EB-5.

Legitimately means don't do it I'm afraid. And just think of all the travel books that wouldn't be on the shelves if people followed that law.
Steve.
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wartNew Member
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Location: Toronto

Post Mon Jun 23, 2008 11:16 pm

any thoughts on what i say at the border considering i'm planning on staying for six months and don't currently have enough money to justify such a long stay? I'm counting on earning more money working while i'm traveling to pay for my expenses. How the heck do i explain that going in and coming out again six months later.

:(
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RebaModerator
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Joined: 16 Jul 2004
Location: North Carolina

Post Tue Jun 24, 2008 4:18 am

Are you flying or driving across?

Don't mention work if you can help it. My uncle was once denied entry because he had some legal case files with him when he was on his way to vacation in Florida. He had to review the files before a court appearance in Toronto, but even though he obviously is not licensed to practice law in Florida, and the files were of Canadian criminals to be tried in a Canadian court, he was "working" and didn't have a proper visa.

He had to turn around, take the files home, and then go back. I think they went to a different POE.
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StevenCanuckAbroad VIP
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Post Tue Jun 24, 2008 7:55 am

You don't need much money to legitimately stay in the US for six months. I worked out in another thread that you need $6,555 for a six-month stay according to their rules. So if you've got something that shows access to that much money you shouldn't have a problem. Most credit cards go up to $5,000 so a credit card with no balance and a bank statement with a few thousand in would be enough (in theory).

Of course, this is all at the discretion of USCIS.
Steve.
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wartNew Member
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Location: Toronto

Post Tue Jun 24, 2008 12:49 pm

Hi Reba, I am taking the bus. But I may do this again some other time flying. Thanks for your advice about files!

Steven - thanks for your advice also. I should be ok on the money front.

I just really wish there was some easy legitimate way to do this, seems so silly that there isn't. are all countries like this?
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RebaModerator
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Joined: 16 Jul 2004
Location: North Carolina

Post Tue Jun 24, 2008 4:50 pm

nope, not so much.

Whenever you're traveling to the US, whether by ground or by air, its always a good idea to have a return ticket. If you're flying and you intend to stay up to 6 months, you can always just change a 2 or 3 month ticket (that's what I did when I stayed for 5 1/2 months a few years ago.) I don't think bus tickets are dated though, so at the very least, make sure its a return trip ticket, and not one way. I had a problem with a one way ticket at the border once, it was a real hassle.

Also, make sure you have some cash in your pockets. Not so much that you'd be destitute if you got mugged, but enough that you won't appear to be a vagrant. Even with credit cards and debit cards, customs and/or immigration will always say "what if they don't work or they're not accepted in the US?" at least they always did with me.

Best policy is to just answer the questions when and what you're asked. Don't elaborate and don't answer a question you *think* they're going to ask you. If they ask why you have a laptop with you on yoru vacation, its for keeping in touch with family via email and/or Skype (if you have it) and to upload digital photos from your digital camera while you're on holiday. Technology is grand :)
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StevenCanuckAbroad VIP
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Post Wed Jun 25, 2008 11:49 am

wart wrote:I just really wish there was some easy legitimate way to do this, seems so silly that there isn't. are all countries like this?


If you work in IT in a similar way to how you do or work as a writer, then yes, pretty much. At least imx. The difference is that the US is more anal about it.

Having looked into it myself in the past and gotten legal advice, the main point to bear in mind is that if you are working by writing and/or on a computer, the only evidence they've got is your computer. You can't be forced to be a witness against yourself (fifth amendment) so unless your computer is seized and they do a forensic analysis of it they have nothing to prove it one way or another (the magic word is "encryption").

And first of all they have to become aware of it.

So yes, technically it's illegal, but Charles Dickens didn't get deported for writing: "Voyages in America" and he told every newspaper wherever he went in the US what he was up to! :lol:

I sometimes wonder what America would be like today if the Indians had tried to stop the pilgrims from landing because they had violated FDA regulations on the importation of fruit and vegetables.
Steve.
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